Speaker 1 0:01

Yo, what's going on everybody? Welcome to the Unstoppable Marketer podcast. With me, as always, is my co-host, mark Goldhart. Mark, how are you? I'm good.

Speaker 2 0:12

Always. It's been a while since we've podcast, oh I know, it's been great actually.

Speaker 1 0:17

You were sick.

Speaker 2 0:19

I was sick and then I left, and then you went on vacation. The worst stomach flu ever passed through my family. It was just hell on earth. It was the apocalypse inside my house.

Speaker 1 0:29

You and me were in a hotel room when you found out, and so I was so nervous that I was then going to bring it to my family.

Speaker 2 0:34

My wife is dying at home. I literally had to hop on a plane. Yeah, we flew out to LA for an event.

Speaker 1 0:41

Yeah, we were sponsoring actually our first event. Okay, like, so excited about sponsoring this event, that night his wife's like I'm dying.

Speaker 3 0:47

She calls me and she's like.

Speaker 2 0:49

I'm dying, and so are the kids and so and we have a 10 month old.

Speaker 1 0:53

Yeah, and so.

Speaker 2 0:54

I'm talking to Trevor saying what do I do? She's probably better in 24 hours, but I probably should go home. Yeah, in 24 hours, but I probably should go home yeah. And she wasn't. It actually lasted like three days for her.

Speaker 3 1:06

Okay, but like good job going home yeah yeah, I feel like that's a big step.

Speaker 1 1:10

Yeah, so we went to dinner and we're like, let's just book you a flight. He was on the first flight out and it was actually good.

Speaker 3 1:18

I mean, not only was it good that he went to help his wife, but it was when we would have been hosting the event.

Speaker 1 1:22

Yes, so that would have been treacherous.

Speaker 3 1:24

And you didn't get it.

Speaker 1 1:25

And then I probably would have gotten sick. It was a miracle. And well, I say this, I'm not going to make a medical claim here but I am a studier of the stomach flu and because I hate it more than anything in the entire world.

Speaker 3 1:38

You're a stomach flu enthusiast.

Speaker 1 1:40

I'm a stomach flu not enthusiast, cure enthusiast, yes, cure enthusiast. And I've learned two things about the stomach flu. There's always a guinea pig who's going to just get it randomly, and they are going to be the person who passes. So if you happen to not be the guinea pig who gets it, the guinea pig who got it was our daughter.

Speaker 2 1:57

She was 10 months.

Speaker 3 1:58

She was the first one to get it. What do you do? Everyone, you do Everyone.

Speaker 2 2:01

You have to help her and we just thought she just, you know, like a 10-month-old that threw up like a couple times Like, oh, she just ate something. So we didn't think anything of it.

Speaker 3 2:08

Okay, but have you seen this whole grape juice and charcoal? Yes, it's cold. What the I started this. You did. Yes, where do you mean you? Where?

Speaker 1 2:17

did you hear this?

Speaker 3 2:27

I just no, I don't remember I don't, I literally don't remember but I went to our like little small town, holistic, like natural grocers, which like isn't legit in idaho where I live, but I got like grape juice. For that very reason I didn't even get into charcoal and I and I never got it.

Speaker 1 2:38

Oh, my gosh, we have to. Even. We haven't even introduced our guest yet. She's just talking. But no, we're gonna. No, no, this is good, I'm going to, I'm going to introduce you, but you don't know. You don't know who it is yet. Actually you probably do, cause you've read the title but grape juice. So what I've learned about grape juice is grape juice. Apparently, it changes the pH levels in your stomach and the stomach bug has a harder time connecting or something whatever so that's number one.

Speaker 1 3:05

Number two is you take activated charcoal. Yes, and activated charcoal is what they give people who od sure right, and it helps them pump their stomachs.

Speaker 3 3:13

And so those two does it come in like a pill form?

Speaker 1 3:17

yes, okay yeah, do you. I don't know what you have just get out of walgreens really yeah, I don't think we got the right one, though you know I don't think so because it was meant for like gas. Like it was like a gas, it was like a control your gas no, I have heard that activated charcoal does help. But help that too. Like, even if your kid has a like like, if our kid ever has like a sugar stomach, we call it sugar stomach.

Speaker 2 3:39

Okay, I always give them one and they always feel better really yeah, for us it's just apple cider vinegar, that's more preventative that's not gonna just downing apple cider vinegar my kids are weird. My kids like slurp down fish oil.

Speaker 3 3:54

They love vitamin, either we, I don't know no, I don't know what my wife did, but it's weird applause yeah they love vitamins, they love fish oil and like fish and crab and. That's awesome yeah.

Speaker 2 4:05

Yeah, good, so they're bizarre.

Speaker 1 4:07

That is it. I'm no doctor at all but you didn't get the flu.

Speaker 1 4:12

But I didn't get the flu and, in fact, and he hasn't gotten the flu Unless Well, I have. I did this year, but it was because I was the guinea pig. Okay, the rest of my family, like, this year was the first year because everybody listened to me and my wife and did it in my family. Okay, and no one. We got the sum of food, the sum of food passed by my family three times this year and only one person in the family got it the whole time.

Speaker 1 4:34

That's awesome, so like I got it, my daughter just barely had it, I mean it was only twice. I didn't get it with you. That's awesome and we shared a bed.

Speaker 3 4:45

Grape juice and charcoal. I'm honored to be sitting with the founder of grape juice and charcoal.

Speaker 1 4:50

Grape juice and charcoal, the fam. I'm going to create a product.

Speaker 2 4:54

I mean, you've been talking about it for about three years. Yeah, I've been on it for like three or four years.

Speaker 1 4:58

I haven't got the stomach flu until this year, for like seven years, because I've been doing that, so I hadn't had the stomach flu in eight years yeah but I don't have kids that go to like a school we're like 10 minutes into this podcast and we are just talking stomach flu.

Speaker 2 5:13

Yeah, should we introduce our guests.

Speaker 1 5:16

Yeah, I think we probably should. I'm very excited for this guest me too. All right, everybody sitting next to us. You've already heard her voice. This is kim olsen. She is the ceo and founder uh brand director, co-founder, co-founder. Sorry about that, you know co-founder of jovi, which is a drug drug. I was saying medical, free drug, free pain relief, menstrual cramp patch.

Speaker 3 5:46

You did great. Yes, that was slow clap, you did perfect.

Speaker 2 5:49

I think you added in like three extra words I could have.

Speaker 1 5:52

You know what the?

Speaker 3 5:53

reality is this it is like groundbreaking technology. There's nothing else like it and it's really hard to explain in five words. So you did great.

Speaker 1 6:03

I did it in six yeah.

Speaker 2 6:04

Great, great job.

Speaker 3 6:05

Well, how are you Good? So good, thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 6:08

Welcome. You just drove down from Rigby.

Speaker 3 6:10

Yes, good old, idaho, a three hour drive.

Speaker 1 6:12

Yeah, just to be with us.

Speaker 2 6:14

Yes, totally Just to jump on the pod.

Speaker 1 6:16

No, we got lucky. I actually was DMing her and I was like I'd love to have you on the podcast. We're not huge fans of virtual podcasts.

Speaker 2 6:27

We do it when we have to sure, but they're just like there's just a different energy. I agree, you know what I mean. Well, even, yeah, with technology, they're still just weird interrupting, like you. Yeah, so it's delayed.

Speaker 1 6:35

You know you don't get the body language and all that kind of stuff, and so I was happy when you said you come down to utah from time to time and I was super stoked that you said hey. I'm heading down and it's like let's do this and then it happened to be in Draper random fate.

Speaker 3 6:48

I meant to be for sure. Thanks for having me here.

Speaker 1 6:50

I'm glad, thank you tell us a little bit about you and let's let's learn a little bit about Jovi and let's just jump into it jump right in.

Speaker 3 6:57

Okay, telling the story of Jovi is actually my favorite thing but let's go first, kim Ol, born and raised Rexburg, idaho. I have a blended family. I always say it's my imperfectly perfect blended family of three. It's really complex when you get into the details of it, but I have a son. And then my late husband has two kids, a boy and a girl. I claim them. I love them dearly. I still see them all the time they come stay at the.

Speaker 3 7:27

Olsen farm, as we call it, which it's not a farm, but still live in Idaho, out in the country, just like live a very simple, beautiful life, love that and we learned that my brother-in-law?

Speaker 1 7:41

yes, you know my brother-in-law.

Speaker 3 7:43

I do, brother-in-law. I do, yes, brother, small town yeah utah.

Speaker 2 7:46

Right ho, it's small yeah, sorry, keep going no please, you're good wait, is olsen, your late husband's last name yeah are they are. That is that related to, like the football family olsen football family.

Speaker 1 8:00

Olsen, what football family are you talking about? I?

Speaker 2 8:02

don't know, like Hans Olsen and like Merrill Olsen, I think. So there's a lot of Olsen-ians.

Speaker 3 8:08

We're Olsen-O-ans.

Speaker 1 8:09

O-ans, okay, and there's some I-ans, Probably I believe it.

Speaker 3 8:14

But I don't know any football. Family Olsens.

Speaker 2 8:17

Alright cool, but I should just be like yeah, Maybe she's related to the.

Speaker 3 8:21

yeah it's kind of like a dynasty of athletes yeah yeah but nonetheless you have a farm I mean, that's not a farm I live. We live on like six acres out in the middle of nowhere see, that's my dream, I have chickens I had. We have horses, they're now you have a dairy cow we did have a couple cows. Those weren't my favorite.

Speaker 2 8:44

We have dairy or just like jersey jersey meat cows is that what a meat cow is?

Speaker 1 8:50

a jersey cow? It's one type of it.

Speaker 3 8:52

Yeah, I don't even know. Angus is what we had red or black?

Speaker 2 8:56

both, and the red were actually really pretty, and you want to know what baby cows are so adorable, but then, but those are the ones that you sell and kill.

Speaker 1 9:05

Yeah, have you seen the TikTok video of the guy who makes a meal and then his cow is in the back of him and he says, like me, trying to eat with my cow. The cow just eats all of his food. Yeah, it's entertaining enough.

Speaker 3 9:17

So you don't like the cows?

Speaker 2 9:18

It's not really a farm that seems farmish to me it's just more like a hobby farm.

Speaker 3 9:23

It's a homestead and it's like adorable Hobby homestead. Yeah, it's great.

Speaker 1 9:26

I love it.

Speaker 3 9:27

It's quiet, it's simple, it's like a life. I never thought I would have Ryan, my husband, actually like brought. He was like I don't like people, I don't like traffic. I mean, he loves people, don't get me wrong, but he, I love ryan. He wanted deer to come into his yard, you know, and so we get moose and deer out there all the time and I just had no idea how much I needed that like simple life that's so cool which is really cool and beautiful yeah, amazing.

Speaker 2 9:55

And so when did you move out there?

Speaker 3 9:57

so I actually lived down here in utah for seven years, moved up there to marry him in 2018. And then I've been there ever since, but I grew up there.

Speaker 2 10:08

Okay.

Speaker 3 10:08

So I still have family there, still have family here, and so you're in this small town and then a big idea comes up later on, right?

Speaker 3 10:16

Yeah, yeah, yeah, so 2020,. Actually, my brother had been introduced into this technology through somebody that he went to MBA school with. The technology was actually created by two scientists and it was created for the military. Basically, how it works is there's billions of antennas inside of there. That sounds really scary. It's even over my own head. We have lots of really smart people and medical directors and all the people that really fully understand it.

Speaker 3 10:46

But my brother had a bad back. Um was about to get surgery. Really didn't want to. He was in his 40s, like just didn't want to. And um through, honestly, like the grace of god one of the inventors was in a really horrible motorcycle accident, was sitting in his hospital bed on all the pain meds, like all the things broke all of his ribs and he was sitting there thinking about how our body runs off of electricity, right Like we have our natural electricity system, and he was thinking about this technology that was created.

Speaker 2 11:21

Yeah, I've been grounding every morning.

Speaker 3 11:23

Good for you.

Speaker 1 11:24

We have a grounding mat in our bed.

Speaker 3 11:25

Good Great, I love it.

Speaker 1 11:27

We know what you're talking about. Yes, heck yeah.

Speaker 3 11:29

Um, yeah, so, and he kind of was laying in his bed and he's like wait, and just kind of started thinking about how the body works, asked his wife to bring it over to him and he started just kind of playing with it and being like wow, this relieves so much of the pressure and the pain when I have this on and it's this is your brother.

Speaker 2 11:45

No, this is the scientist.

Speaker 3 11:48

Yeah, yeah got in a motorcycle accident then we started being like, okay, there's something here, right, that works alongside the body, that's drug free, that, um is just literally working alongside your body and what your body's supposed to be doing. So my brother had created a product called Signal Relief. That's kind of our parent company and I came in very skeptical, honestly. But then you start to see what it does for people and you like pain and the way that it impacts people's lives and those people who are in it every single day, or those people who have to take stuff every single day and that alters their life. Like, whatever it may be, it sucks a lot of like hope and joy out of a person's life who's in it every single day. That's not my personal story.

Speaker 2 12:36

Can I interject Please? My wife has chronic plantar fasciitis.

Speaker 3 12:40

Okay.

Speaker 2 12:42

So she yeah.

Speaker 3 12:43

Yes.

Speaker 2 12:45

Yeah, which there's always like a supposed cure. Nothing really helps, except for just wearing the right kinds of shoes, and that's just relief, sure so, but if she's standing still it's like unbearable pain but like when you're in it, you're willing, you're like what can I do?

Speaker 3 13:00

I like just want this to go away, because it's impacting her every single day. It's impacting her every single day. It's impacting her as a wife and as a mom and like your mental health that's. You know, that's directly in line with what you're suffering from.

Creating a Women's Health Product Line

Speaker 3 13:13

So long story short as his sister, you sit here and you're kind of like whatever, mike, like you're crazy. But then you watch it, like watch what it does for people, and you start to see how it's changing their lives. So long story short, I came in, I flew out to Denver my best friend Susie she was an influencer at the time. She did a lot of business coaching and I was like, hey, we need to create a line for women. Um, biggest thing with this technology is it works for a lot of things, but that becomes a very hard message to market, and so when it's like this, everything patch, then it feels even more placebo-y, right. And so I was just like we need a line for women yes for sure, for sure, and it's new.

Speaker 3 14:03

And our price point is high because of the technology and so and we, we really, really want to keep it here in the us, like you know. So there's just a lot of things that go into that. But I went out to denver, met with her and this is that's kind of where the idea was born. I was just like we need a, we need a line for women, and we honed in on menstrual cramps specifically because the placement of it was simple. It helped for a lot of people.

Speaker 3 14:36

There was a lot of women like majority of women just have a period, um, and obviously the scale of where their their cramps are, what they're going through, what their symptoms are, is very different, but a lot of people are suffering every single month and we had a solution to that. Placement became easy because it was either on your uterus or your lower back, depending on where you're feeling the most pain. And, yeah, out in Denver, an idea was born. So Susie is a dreamer and she is like a risk taker and I needed her so much to be the dreamer and to be like, yes, we can do this. But she came in very skeptical as well.

Speaker 2 15:20

So when did you guys start trying this to see if it works?

Speaker 3 15:22

So funny, so great question.

Speaker 3 15:24

Like before you went out to Denver or Well, yeah, so I had already been seeing it. I had gone out to Denver being like we need to create something, you know, for a brand for women specifically that targets this specific discomfort, because we can help a lot of people. And so Susie's like what the heck? No way, because I had asked her. Her I'm like come do it with me. And she's like no way. So, again, she was an influencer at the time. She jumped on her instagram stories. She's like kim is telling me this thing works. I don't believe it. If you're in rexburg, idaho, right now suffering from cramps, dm us.

Speaker 3 16:01

So we literally went door to door at BYO, idaho and handed them a patch and sat there and were like hey, put it on, Like let's see what this does for you, cause it will, if you find the right spot, it will essentially help quickly, Um and that, and she saw it and she watched it work, and then we built our entire brand with her community, which was like really awesome.

Speaker 1 16:24

So that's awesome.

Speaker 3 16:25

We started saying, hey, what do you think about this? We found our employees through her community and people that you know. We found our copywriter through there and then we found our administrative assistant through there. That was kind of helping us balance all the things. And then we'd be like, hey, we really need to design this, we need a creative person and it all all we. We built the entire brand through, honestly, her instagram like network and community way cool.

Speaker 1 16:51

Wow. What was her? What was her at the time when she was influencing? What was her thing?

Speaker 3 16:55

yeah, good question. So she, she got on the map because she's just like so authentically herself and then, like I said, she had something called Susie School where she came. She's so amazing and she's so good at empowering and coaching and that was kind of her thing. So she had something called Susie School, where, like new entrepreneurs or moms, mostly like women, where she's like, let me help you get the confidence you need to start the business that you're dreaming of.

Speaker 3 17:24

Cool. So, yeah, she had this really loyal following which made for an amazing launch. Totally Like we. I think half a million dollars in under four minutes and we were over a million dollars in like four hours for two little small town. Idaho girls. We were like this is awesome.

Speaker 2 17:42

How many followers did she have at the time?

Speaker 3 17:45

That's a valid question.

Speaker 2 17:46

A hundred and something thousand, wow well, because this is the point I want to make just about influencer marketing is in the past it was like you look, unless someone had millions, it was hard to find success. That was like pre-2020 sure but then we started seeing a shift, kind of starting in 2018-19, where you started getting more of these audiences that were loyal right right. So maybe the follower count wasn't this huge number, but they were following for a real reason, so it was like intent based influencers for the engagement was super high, really loyal, really high returns and the biggest thing for us, again like it feels snake oily.

Speaker 3 18:22

We had the opportunity to have them directly witness and trust our product when it came out, yeah which again and I kind of mentioned this before we even started like we for sure saw you know, like then you're like crap. We have to find these people on our own. Once we get outside of this like very loyal following, so grateful for them, they're like such a huge part of our jovi family, jovi community. But then it was like real life where it's like we have to pay to play and we got to figure it out we got to keep growing.

Speaker 3 18:54

One thing about jovi specifically like and probably I have no problem saying it the worst business decision I ever made was being like let me create a patch that lasts a year or longer if you take care of it. And like, really, I mean, I'm not coming out with new products.

Speaker 3 19:15

So, because our vision and our mission was just to be like we want to help women get their lives back and I want them to see the value in this and I want them to reach for it and I want it to be a household item, because I keep watching what it does for people and for women and so if we stay and for the men listening right, I think, because a lot of men I grew up with, all boys so I was one of four boys. I have five brothers.

Speaker 2 19:46

And I knew nothing of what sure a menstrual cycle did to women honestly knew nothing about it. You kind of joke about like pms and stuff, right as a kid but you have no idea that for some women I mean that's like a four, five day ordeal yeah, and for where they're just in pain for four or five days and, like you, joke about it. But and for some it's pretty severe pain too.

Speaker 1 20:05

Yeah, depending on what your hormones are like, like it's that's what I was going to say Debilitating.

Speaker 3 20:08

There's so many pieces too, and, like Joby, specifically only touches on one part, the more physical part of that yeah.

Maximizing Customer Data Through Smart Marketing

Speaker 1 20:30

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Speaker 1 21:16

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Speaker 3 22:02

For sure, but like also we're literally raised I mean not raised we have to. Your wife can't not be a mom to a 10-month-old for four days.

Speaker 3 22:11

You know, if you're on your high school basketball team, you can't just like stop going to practice and not playing in the biggest game ever just because you're on your period. Some people it will take them all the way out. But, like, life keeps going and we're trained, we're trained and that again has played an interesting role in like, where we're not an impulse buy, our price point is over a hundred dollars. Our entire marketing mission and brand has to be in showing and like, showing our mission and showing the value and creating trust in what it actually does. And when we focus outside of that, when we focus on a quick purchase, like it doesn't pay off in the long run. So, but, but, and to be behind a product. That, again, you see, changes people's lives in so many good ways. It makes it so fun and cool and easy to show up and keep going.

Speaker 2 23:07

And so after that first year when you jumped into these decisions, right yeah, so it sounds like your first year, big launch success. And then maybe there was some overthinking.

Speaker 3 23:17

Sure, well, of course, because then you're like what else can we do? We launched it again on Instagram um, a lot through influencer, and which, by the way, is like you have no idea, until you have a business that relies so heavily on it, on what these partnerships look like. You have no, like the work that they do, as influencing as influencers is really really awesome, um, and I think that it. I think it gets a bad rap a lot of times.

Speaker 3 23:44

But it's incredible what they do um, and what they can do in in a space for a brand. But, yeah, we threw a lot of money at being like, well, let's try this and we're doing so great and let's put our money here. And you know, know, digital marketing and digital ads and whatever, like even podcast marketing, and it gets so expensive, um, and you're just hoping for this recreation of a launch that you're not going to get, um. So, yeah, gear two is just a lot more like we're in the thick of it. We got to figure this out. We're consistently at top of the funnel, like trying to get a, you know, top of funnel consumer, because we are not retargeting a lot right, we have a product that will last.

Speaker 3 24:26

So we have an expensive cpa, um, but if we, like I said, if we focus on the consumer, it and we just kind of play this like slow and steady game. This last year we had a 400% increase.

Speaker 1 24:42

In business has been better than ever, so what were some of the things that you did Cause when, before the podcast and you've kind of mentioned it a little bit just with what you've been saying is like in year two you started throwing money and just trying? A little bit of everything right. What did you hone in exactly to figure out how to flip, kind of the switch to having the year you had, a year two, tier three, being up 400? What was that?

Speaker 3 25:07

I know you said focusing on the customer, but tell me more about what that means yeah, and you guys will understand this, and I have a whole like we have mark, like our digital marketing employees who would be able to speak way better to this, of course but I will be able to say, like you have to take into account COVID, you have to take into account changes with you know, meta and Instagram.

Speaker 3 25:31

Even year two like that was when all of a sudden, the algorithm changes and then you don't have a swipe up option, and then that was our entire business and you're like oh my, my gosh, like that change though we figured it out now and it took time to kind of build that back up.

Speaker 3 25:44

I think, even as a consumer that affects a business who's just like trying to stay on the rise a lot. You know, we were brand new. We're still in that like startup phase. We are putting so much money into clinical studies to show proof of concept and and and and fda approval, um, that we just have to be really smart. So and we weren't for a minute so our biggest thing with with jovi specifically is again, we launched with influencers and then we just went with this influencer management company and we're like here, like Our biggest thing with Jovi specifically is again.

Speaker 3 26:25

We launched with influencers. And then we just went with this influencer management company and we're like here, this works, and so then they just start scheduling out. And we weren't very smart with it. And then we scaled it back and I'm like listen, we can have people get on and talk about it and we can pay them to talk about it, but what we really need is people who, a are willing to talk about it and we can pay them to talk about it, but what we really need is people who, a are willing to talk about their cramps and, b who it actually helps them. And so we switched our messaging of just like pay to play to being like hey, would you be willing to talk about this? Do you, that time of the month, try our products? So I seed a lot of product, but I don't want to book you, and if you don't believe in it and you're not you don't actually have an experience with yourself or someone in your family, that you can talk about.

Speaker 1 27:11

I think that we had jess toolson on from mixers, and so great she said very similar things.

Speaker 1 27:16

I don't know if you remember, but it was very interesting because she said you know, it's been so taboo to talk about periods. Yeah Right, like it's almost more of like a weakness than just a normality. Yeah, at least that's what a lot of, maybe women think. And so she said that the moment influencer, marketing and community building really started to hit with her was when you got somebody to believe in the product and then you had the right person who was willing to be a little bit more open about periods, which is which is? I mean, I get it, I get why that some women feel that way. But it's so funny at the same time and silly, because everyone has one, or most people do you know, but yeah, there's just a stigmatism against saying oh you know, like well, and when, when, and again, I don't.

Speaker 3 28:04

I don't know, like, what her price point is like. But, um, when you get on and you talk about periods and it feels like just I'm pushing a product, and then you go to our website and our price point is 140, you're like freak, no like I deal with this. I've dealt with it for 30 years like I'm good, no matter how bad it is. But when you get on and you say, listen, I had no idea for the last 40 years like what this could do.

Speaker 3 28:28

It lasts a year If you break that down into the price point like it's reusable. Anyone in your family can use it. If you have daughters, they can grab it during their time of the month and you create and you show the value. That's the trusted source and the trust comes in their story, and so it's just way better for us if we have three good ones, versus 30 people just pushing our product?

Speaker 1 28:54

Yeah, spray and pray.

Speaker 3 28:56

And it would be very different if we were in the business of awareness, right, sure, and we're not right now. And it would be very different if we were in the business of awareness, right, sure, and we're not right now, and I think a lot of brands are in that space, but we're on it, we have a mission.

Speaker 1 29:06

Cool. So what I'm hearing is like you're like the biggest focus. The biggest change was you just got focused and narrowed into the right type of influencers because there are so many good influencers.

Speaker 3 29:17

But just because there's a good influencer doesn't mean they're the right influencer for you, and so you kind of almost what mark was just saying is you found the right intent, people you know um and we still have to like strategically, try other things like, for example, we just tried a whole campaign of podcast marketing, like podcast advertising, and um, it didn't work for us and it was a big budget. You know that we put towards it and we did our homework and our research and we looked at all the data and we saw what it was doing for other brands and it didn't work for us and I think we had to try that to know. But I think again, like not being an impulse buy and being a higher price point, you we have to, we have to have a little bit longer to show value in that.

Speaker 2 30:07

Totally. It's interesting too, because I think what a lot of brands don't take into consideration is that it takes X amount of touch points to convince somebody. If you're trying to reach out beyond your immediate buyer type Because you're solving a problem for some people who are like I'm buying that because I just want to solve my problem. But once you get to the people where, it's like I've had it for a while.

Speaker 3 30:30

Like I don't know, is it really that big of a deal?

Speaker 2 30:32

How do you convince them in one moment? You can do that with really great marketing, but oftentimes it's going to take repetitive introductions and touches to convince that person so a lot of people think of podcasting like ag1. Yeah, right, but they're. You have to think about their strategy there, right? They are on so many of them and they are talked about every single time so again, it's an awareness is mentioned every any wellness podcast there?

Speaker 2 31:01

but yeah, I doubt that many people buy in one or two listens of huberman like ag1, ag1, ag1, but maybe after a hundred well, or ag1, the day that they are like man, you know feeling something, and they're like, maybe that ag1 that I keep hearing about is so I do.

Speaker 3 31:18

Yeah, it's super interesting. Um, I don't think that it's a an immediate turnaround on your?

Speaker 2 31:25

yeah, like you said, it depends on where you're at as a business.

Speaker 1 31:27

Sure, yeah, I think that's a big thing. Right, because an ag1 has an insane marketing budget and probably an insane awareness marketing budget that they can. I look at awareness budgets as oftentimes as test budgets.

Speaker 3 31:40

You know that you can just throw money at and well, and then you're just like well or directly. You know we can't pinpoint this to directly attributed, but our overflow is looking a lot better and a lot prettier, since we've been doing that.

Speaker 1 31:51

There's so many, there's so many things how um how important have your customers been as marketing and sales reps for you?

Speaker 3 32:03

I mean, that is the nature of our business and honestly, I think that our customers and we call them our inner circle their stories are what creates that trust, and not only that. Every single one of us sitting in this room like as you guys are sitting here, you can probably think of 15 women that you're like oh man, I know her cramps are pretty bad, or whatever.

Speaker 3 32:30

Like I know she struggles or whatever pain it is or whatever discomfort it is. We all know those people and once they believe in it like that word of mouth has to be a huge part.

Speaker 3 32:43

So, our customers, which again is why we go into their story and just focus on our consumer and try not to you know, because we can have a really huge day or a really huge influencer hit and they'll be like sweet, go spend a million dollars, like increase that budget, go find other people like them. And the second that we do that is the second that we lose focus of the consumer and their experience and our mission and our vision.

Speaker 3 33:09

And, yeah, our, our customers are everything, and word of mouth is everything. Their stories and their experiences are everything.

Speaker 2 33:17

What are your thoughts on customer reward programs?

Speaker 3 33:21

We have one, we do and we open up our inner circle. Our inner circle is our affiliate program, which any customer can go and be like. Listen, I love this product. As I tell my family members about it, I may as well have a discount code and make some cash off of it. Awesome, Because that again their stories are where you lose some of the placebo, and it will always. It's new, it's not something that you've heard of. Even like oils, at this point right, Everyone talks about them and you kind of just know the benefits of them, based off of everyone else Right.

Speaker 3 33:58

But this is very new.

Speaker 2 34:00

But essential oils even like 15 years ago were pretty taboo. Oh yeah, I mean, they still kind of are a little bit.

Speaker 1 34:05

I mean, they're definitely more well-known, but there's still some things For sure.

Speaker 2 34:10

And we'll always have that.

Speaker 3 34:11

People tell me certain things that they do and I'm like I mean they smell nice, but I don yeah, but there's people that believe in them, and it's the people that believe in them, that go tell their other people to believe in them, and so yeah, so it's a huge part of our business.

Speaker 1 34:25

How so? Do you use a specific tool for it or do you just have it like how are you tracking that and can I can I backtrack just a little bit, Please?

Speaker 2 34:33

I think we're digging into this a little bit because most companies have tried reward programs and have failed.

Speaker 3 34:40

Sure.

Speaker 2 34:40

And obviously you need a good product for word of mouth to work. But how do you inject a little more gasoline into word of mouth, right? Like, how do you incentivize people to do that? A, you just have to have a good product and a good experience, right? Right, but is there a way to help incentivize your customers to go beyond a little more? And so has affiliate worked for you in that way? Or is it more of just like hey, we're just focusing, like you said, on our experience, and because we focus so much on the customer experience and their stories, it's a natural flow over and then we have this just kind of like as something that they can take advantage of.

Speaker 3 35:16

I love that you're dialing into this like a little bit and I'm going to be the worst person to speak to it like quite literally. But and let me tell you why. It's because we're like, oh my gosh Again, we started this with such a loyal community and a loyal like fan base and we wanted to reward them and we wanted them to help us spread the word, so we created it very naively. Now it doesn't get a ton of focus on our business and it needs to, and again, not for reasons of revenue and growth, but for reasons of what they do as a valued like, trusting source. And so, yes, we do use Lead dyno.

Speaker 1 36:02

Okay.

Speaker 3 36:03

Does that sound right?

Speaker 1 36:04

I don't know there's so many.

Speaker 3 36:05

There's so many, so you could just make that up and just you say it with confidence and you win. Yeah, it needs. When we talked, like when we sat down at the beginning of the year and we kind of talked about our goals, we have really big cool things coming up. A new product that we've been working really, really hard on that will launch, hopefully, at the end of this year. But our affiliate program and our inner circle program is at the top of that list of something we need to.

Speaker 2 36:32

And another question I have about that, because you said higher price point yeah, when you think of the top brands out there and I know we're talking different stratospheres but like an apple doesn't have affiliate programs, like you don't have customer, yeah, yeah, like, yeah, you might get some, like, oh, like, refer someone for 200 bucks or something. But when you're talking about like a two thousand dollar purchase, it's like, yeah, sure, how many people am I going to convince to go buy this product? But Apple's the best-selling brand in America and most profitable brand. Because of their products and experience, people know what to expect and so they get it, and so people just go back to Apple all the time, right for iPhones and now computers and everything Well, and we'd all be lying if we didn't sit in our business meetings and our planning meetings of being like we want to be the apple of this yeah you know product in this industry, like, of course, they have sent that bet, set that benchmark so high and in such a beautiful way.

Speaker 3 37:27

We'd all love that for sure.

Speaker 1 37:28

Well, well, on the flip side like on the flip side of what you're saying is like delta, yeah, lives off of rewards. Right, like people base their entire ethos yes, it's so true, and I have slowly become one of these people off of my Delta rewards and what?

Speaker 2 37:43

I get, but it's not a referral like affiliate thing. It's like yeah, not affiliate, you're buying stuff anyway.

Speaker 1 37:49

So the affiliate piece is like you get miles right. So like, if I spend X amount of money or if, like I say, hey, get rid of your Capital One card, get. If, like I say, hey, get rid of your Capital One card, get my American, get your American Express, I'm going to get 30,000 extra miles from you when you sign up.

Speaker 1 38:01

You know like I've done that a ton with people Like anytime somebody's, like any young person, like anytime somebody's getting married. I'm like you guys need a credit card, don't you Like? Yeah, we do. I'm like here, yeah, that's good.

Speaker 3 38:20

It's smart, it's hard, like a actual product. You know all those rewards. Obviously you really have to take into account your margins and it gets a little bit tricky. And it gets especially tricky, like when you have influencer marketing who have a good discount, and when you have your black friday sell that has a really good discount, like yeah, we, yeah, it's just it's here's my question for you. Yeah, I hope I can answer it this is not planned.

Speaker 2 38:41

We're just. We're just spitballing right now everyone we always are. But what I guess the real question is what incentivize a cut? Incentivizes a customer to share your product with other people, right, and I think a lot of companies lean into this idea that you can incentivize them with like cashbacks and rewards, but is maybe the biggest incentive for somebody is sharing their story.

Speaker 3 39:12

I know I want to answer this too. You go first. I have a thought.

Speaker 1 39:16

Obviously, I don't know your business the way you do, so you'll have the actual answer, but I think I have an answer to this, that is is is relevant for any business, yours included, and I'm guessing that you're going to key in on what I'm saying, which is I heard a while ago there was this quote that said people don't share money good things to people. People share what makes them look good, and if you that's not like a deviant thing either, right?

Speaker 2 39:50

No, no, no, not at all Something that makes them look good, just because they're helping too.

Speaker 1 39:54

Yeah, everyone likes to be the person to help or solve a problem, and so I would imagine that if joey works for somebody and that is a, I mean there's. There's not a single woman in the world, okay, there's not a single woman in the world who would say I don't want my periods to be better, better, yeah, there's.

Speaker 3 40:16

No, there's not a single woman, I love feeling like this yeah, no one, no one likes that the natural e the Nacho Libre quote.

Speaker 1 40:22

Yeah, and so I would imagine, if it's working like you, go tell everybody that and you are going to help their lives. Like it's not. I'm not sharing this because it's good. I'm sharing this because everyone is going to thank me later, you know, for doing this and, like you said, it's not a devious thing that people do it for that reason, but that's just naturally how we are.

Speaker 3 40:45

So I agree with you and that would have been my answer is you know again, when you have people, when you watch and you see the people that you love suffer and then you watch something, help them. That is the value in our inner circle and our affiliate program. That is what makes someone want to share, and the cash bonus is just like a bonus.

Speaker 1 41:11

Really it's like cool, yeah, I would imagine.

Speaker 3 41:13

And that has to be our focus. I think that people will come in and sign up obviously on like their, their reach, with a different intent maybe, but again, the second that they shift their, their business like of why they want to be a part of it and why they want to share about it and it's and it comes with like this really juicy, beautiful story, like they're just going to make more as well. So our cash, I think, is just a bonus. Our value is in watching and seeing what it does for people's lives, and I think that that's where I have to stay focused, because that directly aligns with our vision and our mission, and not revenue, because we've never we did not.

Speaker 2 41:57

It has to be a byproduct. We didn't create this for revenue yeah.

Speaker 1 42:00

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love it. I mean, I think, like if you can dial like everything into what we talked about, the beauty of this conversation is when you can solve somebody's problems. For sure Effectively.

Speaker 3 42:17

Sure.

Speaker 1 42:18

That's how any business can succeed, right Like you may not go into it saying I want to make this money. It's like, okay, if I solve this problem, then sure the money is going to come, and that's kind of what happens.

Speaker 3 42:28

And do we wish that it like came easier and was beautiful and didn't come with all the like startup, all the things. Of course, but yeah, I think the second, like I said, we deviate from our consumer and from their experiences the second that our business actually suffers.

Speaker 1 42:45

I like it. That's a bar right there. That's a bar, okay. One question for you. Okay, and you may have already answered this, but I love to ask everybody this question on the podcast what's the biggest mistake you're seeing brands make Just you as a consumer and as a business owner? Now, what kind of mistakes are you seeing brands make right now?

Speaker 3 43:06

If you could just call out one To me based off of our own experience. It's trying to be everything everywhere. I don't know that. I can confidently say that it's a huge mistake.

Speaker 1 43:22

But again for my own business, like when we try to be everywhere and every and do everything and yeah it, it doesn't help us, yeah there's, there's a line in, in there's a mark, there's a book called this is marketing and it's written by seth godin, and there's a line that says when, when you sell to everybody, you sell to nobody. Yeah, I believe it.

Speaker 3 43:41

And what you're saying is when, you don't have your passion connected to your work like that's felt as a consumer and as a brand. Um, so yeah.

Speaker 1 43:52

Huge Cool. Well, where can people find Jovi?

Speaker 3 43:55

Good yeah. So we're on Instagram meet underscore Jovi, and then you can go to meetjovicom. We're on Instagram, meet underscore Joby, and then you can go to meet jovycom. Um, it's amazing. I always say like, give it a try. It comes with adhesives, it's reusable, uh, it will last you up to a year.

Speaker 3 44:10

That's crazy, yeah, the adhesives, you just take off and put a new one on once it's not sticking anymore. I personally don't use the adhesive a lot, I'll just tuck it into my leggings. But I am a firm believer that it should be in every medicine cabinet in every home and my kids grab for it. It does so many things, even outside of cramps, that, um, my kids will grab it for belly aches or for headaches or you know like I have kids in sports and I have a golfer and his back will be aching him and he'll just grab it and put it on all the time. So I think that they're really. It's nothing's going into your body, nothing's coming out of your body. It again just works alongside your body's natural electrical system, kind of helping those signals that are going to and from your brain when it's saying like ouch, this hurts, or whatever, and so yeah.

Speaker 1 45:06

Amazing. Thank you, that's so cool. Well, thank you so much for joining us, kim. We appreciate it.

Speaker 3 45:09

Thanks for letting me stop in.

Speaker 1 45:11

Well, thank you so much and everybody. Thank you so much for listening. We will see you next week. Thank you so much for listening to the Unstoppable Marketer podcast. Please go rate and subscribe the podcast, whether it's good or bad. We want to hear from you because we always want to make this podcast better. If you want to get in touch with me or give me any direct feedback, please go follow me and get in touch with me. I am at the Trevor Crump on both Instagram and TikTok. Thank you and TikTok. Thank you, and we will see you next week.